Title:
We Get It | Talking Disability, Identity, and Power
Subtitle:
In Community, Not in Isolation: A Disability-to-Disability Conversation with Olivia Murphy
Transcript:
Alycia Anderson: Welcome to Pushing Forward with Alycia, a podcast that gives disability a voice. Each week we will explore topics like confidence, ambition, resilience, and finding success against all odds. We are creating a collective community that believes that all things are possible for all people. Open hearts, clear paths.
Let’s go.
Welcome back to Pushing Forward with Alycia. I’m Alycia Anderson. Today’s guest reminds me of being unapologetically proud of being a woman, being disabled. She brings all kinds of joy to her own podcast. We met a couple years ago at the Rollettes experience, and it’s been so fun to watch her grow her advocacy as a speaker, and a podcast host, and a disability advocate doing big things in our world.
Her podcast is called Living My Best Disabled Life. She is an upcoming author of a children’s book. We wanna hear all about that.
Exciting. That’s big, huge, amazing. Olivia Murphy. Thank you so much for joining the show. It’s so nice to see you. Welcome.
Olivia Murphy: Thanks for having me. I’m excited for our conversation.
Alycia Anderson: I’m so excited. I’ve really enjoyed, since our paths have crossed, following your platform, seeing all of the big things that you’re doing, all of the interesting conversations that you’re having with so many different people in our community. It’s just been lovely to watch you.
You’ve literally built a brand that talks about living your best disabled life. So I think we should start there, if you don’t mind. What does that mean? What does that mean to you? What does it actually look like in real life, every day in your world?
Olivia Murphy: I built it from the idea all the potential that disabled people can have, what kind of careers they can have, what kind of lives they can live. I also have such a love for storytelling and talking to other people. I know all these disabled people.
I might as well have these deep conversations on how they got to where they are and how everyone’s living their best disabled life, but not necessarily that everything is perfect all the time. It’s the good, it’s the bad, it’s the everything in between, too.
Alycia Anderson: The imperfections of the lived experience are oftentimes, for me too, some of the hardest things, but also where you can pull some of the greatest opportunities out of. So I love that you’re focused on it. Your platform is really beautiful, and I think living your best disabled life reframes how society typically, from a bias standpoint, looks at disability. So I think it’s a really beautiful brand. So congratulations on that. It’s really good. Okay, so let’s rewind a little bit, if you don’t mind. I want to hear about you. Maybe a little bit about your disability, so we can frame for our listeners that don’t know you, what your lived experience is, whatever you’re comfortable with. When did this love for the advocacy really enter your life?
Olivia Murphy: Actually really interesting. I have cerebral palsy, and I’m a late diagnosed autistic. I absolutely hated my disability, most of my life. It wasn’t until my early twenties that I even got into actually finding a love for my disability. I wanted to distance myself from the disability community.
I wanted nothing to do with it. I hated those support groups. But when I got to college, I joined a disability group, and we did events. And then during the pandemic, we starteda speaker series where I was actually the moderator and I would talk to other disabled people from all over. They would come to a Zoom meeting with us and talk about their lived experience. That’s where I was like, “I actually enjoy talking to other disabled people about their experiences.” That’s where the podcast originally came from.
Alycia Anderson: Having a disability from a young age. I had a very similar experience where I rejected my disability. I wanted nothing to do with it. As I was going through school, I really did not want even much to do with the community either. Where do you think that stems from? Because I have a very similar experience.
Olivia Murphy: I think it stems from internalized ableism, honestly.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah.
Part of what we see and what we hear growing up. Elementary school and middle school, I was bullied pretty bad That stems from there too, because not having many friends, not having people that really, truly understand you being the outcast.Yeah.
Olivia Murphy: Literally, when I was in elementary school, they used to assign someone to hang out with me in recess. And that made me always feel othered, too. So I was like, “I wanna pretend I’m not disabled.” Which is really hard when you’re basically disabled.
Alycia Anderson: When you can’t hide it. What would’ve a better solution been back then? Instead of assigning you a friend, what do you think they could have done better back then?
Olivia Murphy: That’s where inclusion comes in. I don’t know why you wouldn’t just find another way to make it less like you’re assigning someone and it’s some sort of chore.
Organically, maybe. Someone invite you to do something during recess.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah.
Olivia Murphy: Instead of, “Hey, you have to hang out with this person inside and not on the playground, because they can’t do anything on the playground. You have to do this because you’re assigned to them for the day, or whatever.” It’s weird.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah, and I feel that messaging right there that we are not only trying to get over ourselves, but also those are the lessons that are brought into adulthood when those other peers end up being CEOs of companies. And feel they were taught that you need to be assigned, and you can’t lead on your own, and you can’t be included, and things can’t be adapted, and you need your own environments, and things like that.
Those lessons carry through life and they’re pretty damaging or they can be. And that’s a perfect example ofwhy the work that we do is so important in education, specifically, to really support teachers in training on understanding how to create better inclusive environments that are more welcoming and don’t put the spotlight on us, that is the “other” spotlight. Ugh. Yeah. That’ll make you resent your disability a little bit.
Olivia Murphy: Yeah, that’s probably where it started.
Alycia Anderson: Okay, so taking those lessons from internalized ableism. Ableism and exclusion, trying to find leaders, trying to find a way to include you that might not have been the best solution to turning that into power and purpose in your life is pretty powerful.
And that came from, what? Overcoming, just navigating? How do you go from that little girl that’s assigned a friend in school to being powerful, like using your voice?
Olivia Murphy: It was college. I feel like I was a different version of myself in college. Because I grew up in a relatively small-ish town, so everyone knows everyone, and there’s no ~really~ reinventing. I feel like everyone reinvents themselves when they go to college, in a way. My college experience was the most accessible experience possible. Yes, I had problems with some friendships or whatever, but I joined a ton of groups. I was on different councils and stuff. Just integrated myself in a bunch of clubs. Not necessarily just the disability club that I was talking about, but I was part of our neighborhood council that planned events and stuff. And yeah, I was the only disabled person in my neighborhood, but just showing up as myself and at some point, I have started not to care. I can’t pinpoint exactly when, but at some point I started not to care that I am disabled. And if other people don’t like me, other people don’t like me, I don’t care. I’ll find my people, eventually, sometime in life, whether it’s in college, or after.
Alycia Anderson: I love that, and I think it comes with age and experience a little bit. I think going through puberty, disabled, and growing up is pretty difficult. College for me was like a coming-of-age, but I think you’re right. I think disability or not, it probably is a situation for a lot of us.
When I went to college, that was when I met my first best friend in a wheelchair. She had spina bifida. And it was just cool to finally meet somebody my age that you could have the same stories. “Oh, I went and bought those shoes and they didn’t fit, or whatever, and this happened.”
And, “Oh, that happened to me.” Or, “Oh, I went on a date with this guy, and this thing happened.” She’d be like, “Oh, that happened to me.” And I never had those moments ofsimilarity with friends that were that similar, until I made a best friend that also had a similar disability. I think that community piece helps you. It’s a coming-of-age.
You feel like, “Oh, it’s not just me. She gets it.” Same experience over and over. Did you run into that?
Olivia Murphy: Ironically, at this point in my life, I probably have more disabled friends than I do able-bodied friends. I did have some friends who were disabled in college, although we don’t really keep in touch anymore. Immediately after I finished college, I joined this group that a friend of mine started in the Tampa Bay area. Every other week, we do different outings, we go have dinner, we do things like that. Connecting it to what you were talking about with your best friend, that is where I found my people. That is where I found that part of me that’s, “Oh, now I have all these people that ask these questions, or I make comments, and they totally understand where I’m coming from.” The disability humor, or feeling the challenges of finding things that are accessible, and so on and so forth.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah. I love that. We were just talking about this before we came on. That’s one of the reasons why I enjoy this podcast so much, because my friendship circle of people with disabilities, all kinds of disabilities is growing and growing and growing. It makes me feel so much safer in my own skin or something. Or braver or, I don’t know, just more together. I don’t even know how to explain it, but it’s really helped me be a braver advocate, honestly, and not be so afraid to use my words and all the things. So that’s really awesome.
Olivia Murphy: Yeah, I definitely think that the more disabled people you have in your life, not necessarily, better off you are, but the less internalized ableism you’re gonna have and more understanding of the disability community as a whole you’re gonna have.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah. I would probably say the better off you are. I think that it creates that place where you really do feel like you belong somewhere fully, and that’s a hard place to find when you have a disability,
Olivia Murphy: Yeah, 100%.
Alycia Anderson: whatever season of life you are in it. Now in my adulthood, not a whole lot will shake me with my disability, but there was a lot of lonely, awkward, strange times that I had to overcome, and I’m sure you’ve had to, too. So, it’s nice when you can start to peel all that stuff back and just be. But when you have a community around you that feels like you’re protective layer and there are people that get you, you feel safe to just be.
Olivia Murphy: Also, no pretending. That’s what I love the most about it.
Alycia Anderson: That’s it.
Olivia Murphy: I’m physically disabled, but I’m also neurodivergent. 90% of my friends are also neurodivergent. You don’t really have to worry about saying the wrong thing as much, or people not understanding where you’re coming from with something.
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So talk about that intersection of your disabilities. I like that you have a multitude, and that some you can visibly see and some are not apparent. Talk about that intersection of disability. What’s harder?
Olivia Murphy: I think the physical disability part. I was diagnosed late with autism. I went most of my life being undiagnosed. I was diagnosed at 24. I’m 27. I knew I was autistic. It was just that I didn’t get a formal diagnosis. But when I got that, it was like a light bulb went off and it all made sense. Then it just became part of me. It wasn’t necessarily like a transition of understanding myself. Actually, it helped me understand myself better. And then I was like, “Oh, I guess that’s now a part of me.” And just as far as the intersectionality with the physical disability, I think it gets more challenging as I get older. My physical disability is actually seen as a childhood disability, when it’s not like we just stop having it. It’s just that there’s not a lot of science or research on adults with CP.
It stops around 18. There’s no adult specialist. Maybe there’s a few in the whole country, but it’s like you’re on your own. So I think that’s actually more challenging than the being neurodivergent part.
Alycia Anderson: Why do you think that is? Why do you think there’s no adult specialization for CP?
Just lack of research and stuff. There’s a part of the Cerebral Palsy Foundation that’s been doing more research. I don’t even know when they’re gonna get to the point where they do have a lot of research for that. You can go to specialists, but they’re not necessarily gonna understand your disability. I’ve had doctors be like, “How long have you been sick with this?” I’m like, “Where’d get your medical degree? I’m not sick. I’ve had it my whole life. What are you talking about?”
Olivia Murphy: I hope it gets better, but I think that’s part of what makes it more a part of my life that’s more challenging is the not knowing.
Alycia Anderson: Wow.
Olivia Murphy: How it’s gonna affect me as I age.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah. I think your advocacy is gonna help that out hopefully, too, moving into the future, to have more resources.
Olivia Murphy: Yeah.
Alycia Anderson: Okay, so tell me about your podcast. What’s the goal with your podcast? Who’s been your favorite guest? Tell our community about your podcast, so they can download it and enjoy it as well.
Olivia Murphy: So it’s not everywhere where you can stream. The whole thing is to celebrate the disability community, educate about disability, and advocate for the disability community. Actually have merch that has that on the back with the logo. The whole idea is just talk to as many people in so many different fields just to see what their life in certain careers are like.
Or just anyone that’s doing anything particularly, I don’t wanna say interesting. All of us are interesting, but I’ve had authors, I’ve had actresses, I’ve had dancers, I’ve had a nurse.I’ve had parents that are disabled, and had episodes about parenting with a disability. I’ve just really enjoyed getting to interview people, but also I’ve formed so many friendships and mentor relationships with people through it. And organically. People sign up for mentorship programs and stuff, but I love how organic it usually is.I usually keep up with every person that I interview, and we keep up a friendship. Sometimes, I even had people on it more than once. If something happened, and they wanna talk about it, they’ll message me and be like, “Hey, I know I was already on the podcast, but this thing came up, and I’d really love to talk about it on your podcast.”
Alycia Anderson: I love it. And hopefully that’s how we’re gonna be, is friends moving forward. I need to come on your podcast.
Olivia Murphy: Yeah, you do.
Alycia Anderson: I really enjoy your podcast as well. Like you said, very organic conversations, and I do think it paints a really beautiful picture of disability and the possibility in it. And it’s incredible that you’ve been doing it five years. Congratulations from one podcast girl to the next. Huge accomplishment.
Huge. Everybody needs to download the podcast. We’re leaving the links, the link to your merch, all the good things in the show notes, so they can find you, follow, subscribe, share all the things. Okay. We talked about in the beginning of the introduction. This is the thing that I’m very excited about for you, that you’ve got a book, a children’s book coming out this year.
Tell us about that a little bit.
Olivia Murphy: Yes, I do. It’s called “How Olivia Learned to Live Her Best Disabled Life.” It’s based on me, but it has some mystical, magical realism vibes. Every person that’s in the book is actually a real person that I have met in real life, and it actually connects back to my podcast.
Alycia Anderson: Very clever, very good, and very needed. What’s the key takeaway for the little ones?
Olivia Murphy: Without giving too much away, there’s an older version of me, which is a fairy-type person that comes and visits the younger version, and takes her on an adventure. She takes her through the future and you see all these different people with disabilities, with different careers. It’s like a dream sequence, which is cool.
One of the best parts about doing this is my best friend is actually an illustrator, so she’s been illustrating for me. I really wanted the book to be fully made by disabled people.
Alycia Anderson: Amazing. I love that. Nice touch. Okay, so coming out this year?
Olivia Murphy: Yes.
Alycia Anderson: We gotta keep our eye on that. That’s amazing. You’ve got a friend that’s an illustrator. Book is on my list too, but it just seems like such a thing to tackle, so congratulations. It’s amazing. Huge accomplishment.
Olivia Murphy: Oh yeah, it’s definitely been a thing. It’s been a lot more challenging than I thought. Eventually, I’ll have a memoir out, but that’s another thing. That’s a whole big project. I’m really excited to have that out. It was originally supposed to be out earlier. Late last year, but we ran into some issues with just logistics. But I’m just really excited for it to be up.
Alycia Anderson: Can’t wait. Can’t wait to buy it for all my nieces and nephews. Congratulations.
Olivia Murphy: Thank you.
Alycia Anderson: Okay, how about some fun questions? Not that these weren’t fun.
Olivia Murphy: Okay.
Alycia Anderson: Couple of fun questions. What is something that people would never guess about you?
Olivia Murphy: I’m a huge reader.
Alycia Anderson: Oh, a huge reader. What kind of books do you like to read?
Olivia Murphy: I’m really into audio books, too. I really enjoy reading other memoirs written by other disabled people. But I love a good romance.
Alycia Anderson: Oh, I like it. Cute.
Olivia Murphy: I love a good romance. I like some self-help stuff, but I’m mainly into contemporary romance or memoirs. And I’ve been really into just, no matter what kind of book it is, I have been trying to read as much disability representation as I can. I love when the characters, even in fiction books, are authentically represented.
Alycia Anderson: Can you recommend a good book? A good fiction book, that there’s authentic representation. I like that. If you don’t know it now, you canleave it in the link.
Olivia Murphy: I have so many. I can’t even. But if they want a memoir, I just read, recently, Molly Burke’s Unseen.
Alycia Anderson: Was it good?
Olivia Murphy: That was really good. I felt potentially that I wouldn’t relate to it because I am not blind and that my disability is different, but there’s so many overlapping themes in there that I still really related to.
Alycia Anderson: I love it. I need to read her book. I haven’t read it yet. Okay, so you just mentioned the word representation, specifically in fiction books. Can you remember the first time that you saw yourself authentically represented, and what was it?
Olivia Murphy: I can’t say I have seen myself authentically represented in media that much because I’m multidimensional, and I’m not just physically disabled. So typically, I will feel seen when there’s a wheelchair user, but a lot of times, the wheelchair users are not ambulatory wheelchair users. Or I will feel seen sometimes when there’s authentic autistic representation. But, a lot of times, females aren’t represented as much as males. So I can’t say a specific time because of the fact that there are parts of things that I’ve watched or read that remind me of myself, but not necessarily one specific moment.
Alycia Anderson: You know what that reminds me of? We’re siloing disability, right? You either have a physical disability or you have a non-impaired disability. You have this or you have that. The reality is, the same with me too, there’s intersectional layers of it, probably for most of us, that don’t get the attention together.
Your answer is, there is no authentic representation yet. I haven’t seen it.
Olivia Murphy: Yeah, I would say some. Not necessarily ones that I’m like, “Oh my God, I see myself in every aspect of this person.” I would say that I recently started reading, I’m gonna butcher her last name, but it’s Chloe Liese or something. And she is some form of physically disabled, but also neurodivergent. But every one of her characters are some form of disabled.
So I’ve been really into that. I think I see myself in her female main characters, in terms of the autism because it’s less obvious. Because I think there’s a misconception that some people don’t seem autistic enough, and I’m one of those people that typically wouldn’t be seen as that autistic, which it’s a spectrum.
Alycia Anderson: Yeah. Did we miss anything?
Olivia Murphy: I think we got everything.
Alycia Anderson: I’m gonna leave all your information in our show notes. So anybody who’s out there who wants to book you to speak, to come on your podcast, to buy your book, to follow you, to do all the things. They’ll have access to find you. And I would love to wrap up the show, if you’re open to it, with a pushing forward moment that might be like a little advice for the next generation of young ones with disabilities that are navigating this, or to parents, or something.
Can you give a little advice, or mantra, or something you live by?
Olivia Murphy: If you wanna do something, you can probably find a adaptive way. Don’t let your disability stop you, but also don’t see it as a barrier. Not saying you have to love your disability all the time. It’s okay to have moments where you’re like, “I don’t like my disability right now. I would like to not be disabled.” And then also, sometimes be like, “Oh my God, I love my disabled life.” I think I struggle with that sometimes. ‘Cause being an advocate, you feel like you’re always on, you always have to be all peppy and, “Oh yeah, being disabled is great.” When in reality, it’s not great all the time. I would say remember to try to find that balance.
Alycia Anderson: Remember to try to find the balance. I love it. Olivia, thank you for all of the advocacy and the work that you’re doing in our community. You show up in so many different ways. I constantly am seeing your content, and your advocacy, and the beautiful way that you deliver it. For any of our community that is not following you or listening to your podcast yet, they will be after this.
Alycia Anderson: I really appreciate you sharing your story on the show, and it was really nice to see you. Thank you so much.
Olivia Murphy: Thank you so much for having me.
Alycia Anderson: This has been Pushing Forward with Alycia and Olivia, and that is literally how we roll on this podcast. We will definitely see you next week.